When it comes to business school rankings, the Princeton Review takes a refreshingly unique approach. Instead of offering a single, hierarchical score, it evaluates schools across multiple dimensions based on student and alumni feedback combined with actual data. Hosts Pola Lem, Maria Wich-Vila, and guest Michelle Belden dive into how this method not only provides a broader perspective on the strengths of various programs but also helps unearth schools that might be overshadowed by the “M7 or bust” mindset.

One of the standout features of the Princeton Review’s rankings is their focus on fit rather than prestige. By paying less attention to the reputation and instead highlighting program offerings, specializations, and campus culture, these rankings empower applicants to find programs that align with their personal and professional goals. As Maria explains, they showcase schools that might not always make the top of traditional lists but offer valuable, specialized experiences.

Michelle, with her background in Wharton Admissions and Fortuna Admissions, provides insight into how traditional rankings emphasize overall reputation, which remains crucial for alumni and institutional marketing. However, she also underscores the advantages of the Princeton Review’s approach for applicants, who benefit from a more nuanced understanding of what different programs offer, helping identify exceptional schools that align with their aspirations. This methodology challenges the norms and encourages candidates to look beyond conventional rankings to find the best fit for their MBA journey.

Episode Transcript

Note: This transcript was generated by AI and may contain minor inaccuracies.

[00:00:03] – Pola

The business school ranking, one number to measure excellence. Each year, schools’ fortunes rise and fall. So is it convenient shorthand or a recipe for disaster? Well, one ranking does things very differently. That’s the Princeton Review’s ranking. Its Best Business Schools for 2027 is now live, and today we’ll talk about what this ranking measures, why it’s different, and how it can be useful for prospective students. I’m Po Lam for Poets& Quants, and we’re back this week with my co-host Maria Wich-Vila, founder of ApplicantLab. And also this week, we’ve got a guest, Michelle Belden. Michelle is director at Fortuna Admissions, and she’s a former associate director of admissions at Wharton’s MBA program and also a former recruiter at Bain. Plus, her bio says she bakes killer chocolate chip cookies. So welcome, Michelle.

[00:00:58] – Michelle

Thank you so much for having me. I’m happy to be here and excited to talk with Maria and you about the rankings.

[00:01:04] – Pola

Yeah, so, so let’s get right into it. So this Princeton Review rankings, they go live midsummer, and it’s not just one number per school. So that’s the key point here. And since 2004, this ranking has taken a very different tack to just about most other rankings I can think of. So they say, we don’t believe any one business school is best overall. Hierarchical rankings that crown a single B-school as best are of limited value as ipso facto, the majority of applicants will hence attend a less than best school. The B-schools we named to our list differ importantly in program offerings, specializations, requirements, and campus culture. Maria, give us a brief overview of this ranking and compared to its peers that use one overall score per school, how does it work?

[00:02:03] – Maria

So the Princeton ranking, what they do is it’s a combination of polls that they give to about 24,000 Students and alumni of different programs. And then they also combine that with actual data. And so instead of saying, well, you know, here’s this one number that we, we’ve taken a number of factors and we’ve consolidated them into one number, and that number is your ranking. They have taken it across multiple dimensions and come out with a top 10 list across each one of those dimensions. So it’s different in that it is really based a lot upon the subjective opinion of these polls and these, you know, these surveys that have been done. And there’s, you know, that’s, that has its pros and its cons as terms of, you know, the rigor of the methodology. But, you know, it’s, it’s interesting in that it does highlight different schools that I think otherwise fly under the radar of the folks who come into this process with an M7 or bust mindset.

[00:03:05] – Pola

And we talked about that a little before we started. So, Michelle, I’ll ask you about that. But also, this particular ranking downplays the reputation element at schools. And since you used to be at Wharton, I’m curious, how did it regard this ranking versus other ones?

[00:03:25] – Michelle

Yeah, I mean, it is a very different approach. And what I think as the schools go out and they do their info sessions and they talk to students and they give their presentations, they’re always going to really rely on those traditional, you know, ranking systems. As well as I would also say additionally, the alumni, right? They’re going to want to use those, oh, my school is ranked this overall. So there’s that element that I just don’t think is ever going to go away or get diminished. But I do see the value of this Princeton Review ranking with these across 18 dimensions. And I think it really does benefit the applicant, the candidate. And to Maria’s point, I think there’s a lot of amazing programs under the— out there that are under the radar that this, you know, review really brings to light. And also, I think I’m all about the fit. So, but going back to with my Wharton hat on, I mean, you kind of have to rely on who’s talking about me and shining a light on me the best in what way. And obviously those overall rankings, you know, really do that.

[00:04:27] – Michelle

This is a little bit more only the top 10. So if I’m not in the top 10, I’m not even highlighted within a— if it’s the in the classroom, the professors, etc. So, you know, how much time and effort will they really, you know, give to that unless they’re one of those schools that across, you know, 6+ dimensions have ranked in the top 10, right? So it’s kind of a good and bad and how the schools, I would say, I feel like they’re really going to continue to discuss and highlight those overall rankings where, again, the top schools are really always within the discussion and in those top ranking spots.

[00:05:04] – Pola

And to clarify, I mean, I think you’ve said this, but these are top 10 in various subject areas that this ranking measures rather than the top, like the M7, you know, the schools that consistently top the rankings charts or lists across the board. So that said, let’s talk about scores. So Stanford Graduate School of Business actually racked up the highest number of number 1 rankings for the Princeton Review. It owned top spot across 4 dimensions. So this is career prospects, Best classroom experience, the best MBA for management, and toughest to get into. So in a way, there’s definitely some overlap there. And we see that Cornell University’s Johnson Graduate School of Management got this top feat across 3 dimensions so that for them, it was best MBA for finance, best administered, and this is an interesting one, most family-friendly. But as you say, it’s not just the big brand names that really dominate these top lists. So to run through a few of the sort of lesser-known or sort of, you know, less— not as perhaps prestigious schools, we’ve got the category of greatest resources for minority students. In that case, the first place goes to Hofstra University, their Zarb School, and Bard College and Brigham Young University’s Marriott School ranked first for best schools for nonprofits and human resources, respectively.

[00:06:51] – Pola

So it gets actually even more diverse if we look past those first-place finishes. So we’ve got examples like the University of Tennessee, they finished third for best administration. Rochester Institute of Technology was great, uh, 3rd for greatest resources for women. So you see it really broadens out this group. So Michelle, how valuable, um, is this approach? You alluded to the fact that this is useful for applicants, um, that, that sort of broader spread of schools and seeing what they’re good at.

[00:07:27] – Michelle

Yeah, I think for the sophisticated candidate out there, they’re going to use this as a tool, right? Like, look at these different dimensions. If, like, to your point, coming in with a family— and there are many at least that maybe have a significant other, if not kids already, that, that, that little category might be like, oh, that’s really interesting, who are in the top 10. I hadn’t even considered looking at— was it Cornell that you said was the top program for that? So I would go do a little research there. So I think there is really— I would say the advantage goes to these sophisticated, you know, candidates out there that are doing their research, that they can really go and, you know, really, you know, intentionally look at these different categories. And I really want to go to school that has that supportive, collaborative community that I’m reading in, you know, if I go and look at these rankings, that the alumni and current students are really your biggest advocates in helping you find that next job, right? That might be something that you’re really focused on. So I feel like the advantage goes, um, to the, the candidates, and that’s just another tool for them to use.

[00:08:33] – Michelle

Um, again, I, I don’t think it’s a replacement For the other rankings, I just think it’s, you know, really, I think it’s actually just, you know, the opportunity to go and look at and really highlight these other, the other programs. I hadn’t even thought about this program, like ones that you just highlighted in this category. Let me go and, you know, do a little bit of my own research, um, et cetera, and see where that leads me to. So, I mean, I think that’s how you get started and kind of the jumping off point, especially really honing in on the different categories.

[00:09:03] – Pola

Sure. And I mean, there are some fairly kind of unique in the traditional sense rankings categories. So I think we’ve already mentioned the greatest resources for female students. They have one that’s for minority students. For the one for female students, what gets factored in is whether the school offers coursework for women entrepreneurs and whether the case study materials for classes proportionately reflect women in business. So, Maria, if you play devil’s advocate for us for a minute, I mean, that definitely sounds interesting, but at the end of the day, is the most important thing to students not just ROI and prestige, really?

[00:09:51] – Maria

Yeah, I mean, I think, well, I think on a pragmatic level, a lot of people go to business school for those results for that ROI. But I also think that it’s important to know a lot about the culture of the school that you’re going to, because the most valuable thing of any business school is the network that you develop in the time that you’re there. And if you are at a place that isn’t the right cultural fit for you, you’re gonna be less likely to develop those strong bonds and those strong friendships that end up becoming the main asset that you take with you after you graduate. So, you know, I can, I can see why they break that out. You know, I, it may not have a lot of numeric value, but I think it does have value for, for folks who are looking to be in a supportive environment during their, their 2 years.

[00:10:44] – Pola

Sure. And we have been talking about the upshots, but Michelle, what are the cons of this sort of ranking system?

[00:10:53] – Michelle

Yeah, I mean, one that I might have even read in the article is it’s, it’s just the top 10. It kind of, as I looked at all of the different categories and how they listed the schools, I’m just wondering if it would be more useful if it was a top 15, 20, so you can kind of cross-calibrate a little bit better. So that kind of bothered me, and I would say a downside that what if, you know, a school was number 11 or 12? And the other thing was how much, you know, You know, as Maria went over who was, you know, surveyed, how many people is— I’m just questioning the details of how many students replied from each school. You know, what is the differential between the 1st ranking and the 2nd ranking? I don’t know if all that data was really, you know, shared with us. So you kind of take it at face value. So, but it is a not quite sure, you know, how much again. you know, not that’s not reliable, but like, you know, I would love a little bit more, especially I think people going into business school, the analytics of it and just those numbers would be quite helpful.

[00:11:57] – Michelle

But even just the build-out of a little bit longer list so I could say Stanford was number 1 across these. Okay, again, if we say just M7s, how does the, these, the schools that are in those M7s also, where did they end up on the list? And if it cuts off at 10, I just feel like because they really have this, again, great variety of schools. It’s tough to then, you know, to weight that.

[00:12:21] – Pola

Sure, definitely. I mean, the other thing that struck me is that this is also true of U.S. News and World Report, but obviously the Princeton Review is looking at American programs.

[00:12:32] – Michelle

Yes, absolutely.

[00:12:36] – Pola

So if you’re interested in international schools, it doesn’t really serve your purpose. And as you say, you don’t really get a whole lot of detail behind why these, if any at all, really behind why these decisions were made and the, you know, when it gets into the metrics. So I’m curious, I mean, they do say that these rankings lean heavily on student surveys and I think it was something like 24,000 students surveyed for these categories. How useful, Maria, are student surveys generally in gauging how good a school is, how well it serves its students?

[00:13:25] – Maria

Yeah, I think surveys are, I mean, it’s better than nothing, but they can be a little bit, some of the downsides of surveys are, first of all, the biggest downside is that Most people only go to one business school. So if I’m saying, well, the administration at my school is the best, or the professors at my school are the best, how could I know if I didn’t go to another business school? So that’s a little bit, you know, kind of like, well, it’s, it’s very subjective. And then also, you know, one of the things that has always been a little bit curious to me about this, this, you know, this ranking is that you can’t help but wonder if certain schools I don’t know if they— it’s not a conspiracy, but if they really band together and signal very strongly to their students and alumni, like, look, you’re going to get the survey from Princeton Review. You better say that we’re really good at this or that, because, right? Because sometimes you’re like, some of the results that are a little bit more of head-scratchers, it almost seems like there has to be some sort of concerted effort amongst the students who replied.

[00:14:29] – Maria

Because there are some random ones like most competitive students. And I’m like, what?

[00:14:33] – Pola

Where did that—

[00:14:34] – Maria

I think it was like Drexel or something. I’m like, oh, okay, fine, but what? So it does seem a little, you know, I think Michelle brought this up too, like we don’t know how many people reply per school. It just, it gets a little bit, because there’s so much opacity, it does become a bit difficult to say, well, okay, which questions exactly were asked and how, you know, if it were a qualitative If it were an open text box, how are you measuring that text box? Or was it just a ranking of 1 to 5, good, bad? So, there are so many questions, but I think the toughest thing for me about surveys is that, like, I don’t know, I loved my business school. I thought it had a great classroom environment, but I also never went to another business school, so I don’t know what to tell you.

[00:15:23] – Pola

I mean, This, yeah, so this gets to the heart of one of the weaknesses of this method of appraising schools. But rankings obviously are tough because no matter how you cut it, there are always going to be shortcomings with various methodologies. So I guess, Maria, to follow on to that, you know, what are the most useful ways in your view to gauge how well a school is doing and meeting its students’ needs?

[00:15:53] – Maria

So I have said in the past that I actually would create my own ranking that covers metrics that are not currently covered by any of the rankings. So in terms of the ones that are out there, what are the— it would be sort of an element of, you know, sort of forced ranking.

[00:16:12] – Pola

Like if you got into this school or that school, which one would you pick?

[00:16:15] – Maria

If I had to choose one metric, for me it would be yield. Because I think that that’s where the rubber really hits the road is when someone actually has to then take out the student loan and pay the deposit and pay the tuition. Where do they actually end up putting their money? But so I think yield is probably the most valuable one. And yeah, aside from that, I would look at the career placement numbers and really dig into those reports, not just look at the high level. percentages, but really look at who are the top employers, how many people are able to switch careers. So, for example, a school might say, well, a certain percentage of our class went into consulting, but if a lot of them came from consulting, for example, you know, are a lot of them just going back to consulting? What’s that delta? So, that’s another metric that I tend to tell people to look at that is not part of the official rankings that I think is Very valuable.

[00:17:14] – Pola

Interesting. So, Michelle, when you were at Wharton, were there any metrics that you wished had been judged more or less?

[00:17:24] – Michelle

Man, it was a while ago, but I would say, I mean, honestly, I can’t really remember in the sense of The schools, you know, have their— what they are really, their marketing and how they speak about themselves, right? And how they are positioning themselves. So however they can, I would say, connect that best to a ranking that year, you know, and how, you know, sometimes, you know, the top rankings are kind of trying to change their metrics and who they ask and how they evaluate is, you know, it’s really a— we’re gonna jump onto this because it really, you know, provides that foundation and support of what we’re trying to say. About our program, that Wharton is not just a finance school, that we offer all these other avenues, the entrepreneurship, the interdisciplinary opportunities, et cetera. So, I would say it’s really aligning themselves with what works for the school itself, and as they’re going out and speaking and having conversations with prospective students about, you know, you know, what makes them the best or where they are really their strengths. And I think this really goes to Maria’s point about yield, is at the end of the day, If, you know, you get that offer from, you know, these 3 schools, which one are students choosing at the end of the day?

[00:18:46] – Pola

Well, agreement there on yield, and I think we’ve covered off this particular ranking fairly well. So we’re going to switch gears for a minute and talk a little bit about lovely summertime. So today in Poets and Quants, we’ve got a story with input from a handful of deans from Europe and the United States with their recommendations for things students can do over the summer months, how to both unwind but also be productive. So one of the questions I found was quite interesting, and a thread running through this piece was the biggest mistakes that they see students make during the summer months. And I would love to hear both of your opinions on this, but first I’ll just read the response from the dean at Vlerick Business School, which is, the most common mistake is treating the summer as either total shutdown or nonstop hustle with nothing in between. And these both fail for the same reason. Neither of them leaves room for reflection. So I thought that was quite interesting, and there were some other deans in the mix talking about how they recommend that students spend their summer productively, but equally they don’t want them arriving on campus super burnt out.

[00:20:17] – Pola

So to start us off, Maria, what are useful, good ways to spend the summer? As a business school student, and what would you recommend against doing?

[00:20:32] – Maria

The most useful way to spend a summer as an MBA student is to do an internship or 2. Like, I don’t, I don’t, I don’t, I guess, I guess if, if the idea is like, oh, you should also, I mean, you should also take a break, I suppose, but you’re going to business school to advance your career more than anything. And if you can get one, or perhaps, I know sometimes people will stack internships. So back in my day, we would just do one 10-week internship. And now I, I’ve heard of people doing, say, you know, a 6 plus a 4, or trying to, to, you know, mix and match different internships during their summer. But, you know, at the end of the day, you’re gonna need to have a job when you graduate.

[00:21:15] – Pola

Mm-hmm.

[00:21:15] – Maria

Um, and internships can be really valuable because not only can they help you get a job, but they can also help you realize what jobs you don’t want, which is sometimes just as equally valuable information to have. So, yes, I mean, sure, take a week or two off and don’t show up too burnt out, but I applaud the nobility behind the work-life balance idea, but I think pragmatically, I think they should focus the most on just trying to set themselves up for that post-graduation job search. All right.

[00:21:54] – Pola

Maria says full steam ahead. Not too much of a break. Don’t rest on the beach. Michelle, what’s your advice?

[00:22:02] – Michelle

I mean, I have to agree. Like it did when you were saying it, I was like, isn’t the summer their biggest opportunity? Because it’s the summer internship that again, I would love actually what Maria said is not only is it a time to be like, is this a place I want to be, the industry, the work, or actually, you know what, I need to do a little bit more of a pivot. Or, you know, maybe this gave me the you know, understanding that this isn’t really what I want to be doing post-MBA. So, I can then continue conversations with other people, companies. So, it is a time to not to, like, continue to grind. I mean, you got to lock it in. And I definitely believe you will have the opportunity to do a bit of a recharge. You take that, you know, week or two off, or, you know, that’s 100%. I understand what they’re saying to come back really excited about your second year. But I think the summer is key to your excitement for the second year and really how to intentionally take advantage of that second year by what you’ve done during the summer.

[00:23:00] – Michelle

And, you know, me working with all my clients is the, what is your game plan? Well, taking advantage of that summer internship for the people especially that want to do a pivot is absolutely going to be the linchpin, the, you know, jumping off point to go into what’s next for them. Or it’s the people that will be continuing in, let’s say, the banking and getting that opportunity, you know, And it’s a huge opportunity. So, I think there’s always a balance. I think I am one to— I don’t know if the article spoke about this, but I’m all about mental health and really giving yourself the opportunity to read the book or see friends and connect. But I think when you have the opportunity to go to business school, to take full advantage, and the investment is that summer between first and second year is a real key aspect that you would never want to miss that opportunity.

[00:23:52] – Pola

Agreement here again. Relax, but in moderation, I think, is our takeaway. All right. Well, that marks the end of another episode. Thank you both so much for joining, Maria, as usual, and Michelle, for being our guest this time around. And thank you everyone for listening. If you enjoyed today’s podcast, please do check us out on poetsandquants.com. We have lots of episodes with various topics for you to dig through, and we’ll be back again next week. Thanks, everyone.